Arti Mala, the founder of First Seed Foods, recently joined Glen Merzer on The Glen Merzer Show to discuss her mission to make Indian cuisine healthier and more accessible. Growing up with Indian food as a household staple, Arti’s deep-rooted love for the cuisine inspired her to create plant-based, oil-free versions of classic dishes that offer all the flavor without the heaviness of traditional restaurant fare.
In the interview, Arti shared her passion for staples like lentils, rajma (kidney beans), and a variety of vegetables like okra and cauliflower. These dishes, available from First Seed Foods, are prepared without any dairy, ghee, or oil, making them not only vegan but also heart-healthy and guilt-free. As Arti puts it, “They taste just as good, if not better, than some of the foods you’ll find in a typical restaurant.”
Arti’s company ships frozen meals across the contiguous U.S., ensuring that customers receive their orders within just a few days. What sets First Seed Foods apart is its commitment to using organic ingredients, making it a rare find in the world of Indian cuisine. As Arti explains, “We prioritize organic ingredients, and we’re working to get all our spices certified as well.”
The conversation also touched on the challenges of raising vegan children, the importance of spices in Indian cooking, and how Arti’s corporate background influenced her approach to creating a sustainable business. Her goal? To bring healthy, delicious Indian food into more homes while proving that plant-based meals can be just as satisfying as their traditional counterparts.
Catch the full episode of The Glen Merzer Show to learn more about Arti’s journey and how her vegan Indian meals are changing the way we think about healthy eating.
Watch the full episode of here: Arti Mala Makes Indian Food Healthy, Delicious, and Available To You!
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DISCLAIMER: Please understand that the transcript below was provided by a transcription service. It is undoubtedly full of the errors that invariably take place in voice transcriptions. To understand the interview more completely and accurately, please watch it here: Arti Mala Makes Indian Food Healthy, Delicious, and Available To You!
Glen Merzer: Welcome to the Glen Merzer show. You could find us across all your favorite podcast platforms. You could find us on YouTube. And please remember to subscribe. And you could find us at RealMenEatPlants .com. My guest today is a woman I'm meeting for the first time, Arti Mala. She is the founder of First Seed Foods. I came across First Seed Foods when I ordered from this wonderful company and she'll tell you more about it. These are healthy Indian foods. Arti, welcome to the show.
Arti Mala: Thank you so much for having me on, Glen.
Glen Merzer: You know, people have their favorite foods. You know, some people's favorite foods are Italian foods, and some people Thai food, and some people Mexican food. And everybody's entitled to their opinion, of course. But objectively I just want to say that scientifically and objectively, the best food in the world is Indian food.
Arti Mala: my gosh. 100 percent. I have bias whatsoever.
Glen Merzer: None at all. I don't even have Indian blood as far as I know, but I have always loved Indian food. Now, did you grow up eating Indian food?
Arti Mala: I did.household staple for us. So I've spent most of my life in the States, but I also lived in India with my grandparents for a few years and both here and there most nights of the week and even now as an adult raising kids most of the night where most nights of the week were enjoying Indian food.
Glen Merzer: And what what are your favorite Indian dishes.
Arti Mala: So I'm you know. Funny enough, it's some of the foods that we operate for a seat. So I guess this was all very selfishly driven. Just wanted clean eats of some of my favorite foods. I end up having a lot of lentils. So different types of dolls, there's such a large variety that are out there, but that's such a staple. And then Rajma, kidney beans is also, I think, a cult favorite, especially for folks of Northern Indian descent. Rice and beans is just your classic. No matter what, will that will always satisfy you. So those are some of my favorites. I'm very lazy when it comes to cooking vegetables. But when I have more family around that's willing to spend the time and effort to cook some of these vegetables like okra and cauliflower and so on, then I tend to love those as well.
Glen Merzer: Now, you ship your foods all over the country. Is that right?
Arti Mala: That's right. So within the contiguous US, unfortunately, we're not able to ship to Hawaii and Alaska.
Glen Merzer: Right.
Arti Mala: Just the logistics of frozen shipping are so complicated, but we do everywhere. The 48 states, we ship everywhere. So that's been it's been fun to be able to serve so many folks.
Glen Merzer: And how long does it usually take people to get their food? Let's say they're in Colorado.
Arti Mala: Yeah. So we ship out of two full women's centers at the moment. One is in the northeast. It's in New Jersey. The other is in the south in Texas. And so if you're closer to one of those, it's next day delivery. In the summer, because we had been expediting a lot of our shipments because summer temperatures just got to be so high, we were seeing a maximum of three days. In the winter, when we have a little bit more flexibility, just because it's a little colder outside, we can keep your shipment frozen for longer. The furthest points out, think like, you know, certain parts of the state of Washington, Oregon, you would see a four day delivery, but A majority of customers get their order within one or two days, which has been really nice. We're hoping to start shipping out of California too, which is going to shrink that delivery time for some folks. But yeah, it's usually all of our orders go out once a month on a Monday and that same week they are with our customers.
Glen Merzer: All right. Now here's the good news to my listeners. Even though Indian food is the healthiest food in the world,I mean, the most delicious food in the world. When you go to an Indian restaurant, you often have to watch out because they use a lot of dairy and there's a key and oil also in the foods. Arti's foods at first seed foods are healthy Indian foods, all vegan and all oil free. Is that right?
Arti Mala: That's right. Yep. One hundred percent plant based. So we don't use any animal products whatsoever. Certainly not any dairy or key or any of that sort. And then also, yes, like completely oil free, no oil, no butter, no ghee of course. And they still taste delicious. They taste just as good, if not better than some of the foods that you'll find in a typical restaurant.
Glen Merzer: Well, I have tried your foods and they are delicious. And it's just so nice to know that you're eating something that's not only delicious, but it's healthy. I used to go to Indian restaurants all the time and I would try my best to make sure that I ordered vegan and that there'd be no dairy in it, but I was never 100 % sure what's going on in the kitchen. And then it was almost always oily. And then I like to eat my Indian food with bread.
Arti Mala: Mm hmm.
Glen Merzer: That's I mean, that's the traditional way to eat Indian food, isn't it?
Arti Mala: Yep.
Glen Merzer: And I knew not to get the naan because the naan had dairy. So I would always order the roti.
Arti Mala: Yep. That's right.
Glen Merzer: But recently I went into an Indian grocery store and I discovered the roti was made with margarine.
Arti Mala: sometimes can be. Yeah. So
Glen Merzer: I thought I was having the roti to be healthy and not so much. So it's just hard to trust Indian restaurants or any restaurants really to give you really healthy food.
Arti Mala: I agree. I think restaurant food is just a category in itself. think across cuisines. But I've certainly felt that way for Indian food. I we very rarely will eat at an Indian restaurant because it's, I think we tend to feel like it's too indulgent and we just don't feel that great afterward versus what could be a really light and refreshing meal. And the other part is for folks who are prioritizing organic ingredients, you'll almost never find organic ingredients in a majority of restaurants. There's a tiny few that offer that, but it's one of the things I'm really happy to offer at First Seed is that all of our...beans and lentils, all of the fresh ingredients that we use are all organic. There are some spices that we're working on sourcing to be 100 % organic and that way we can apply for a certification as well. that's been something that our customers have really appreciated who do prioritize organic foods.
Glen Merzer: Yeah. I mean, Indian food is naturally healthy if it isn't spoiled with dairy and oil. Naturally healthy foods like lentils and On top of that, you source it all organic. And on top of that, there's no oil and you offer salt free to those who request that. And what about gluten free?
Arti Mala: All of our meals are naturally gluten free. So there's no gluten in any of our meals.
Glen Merzer: There you go. So, I mean, you just can't order healthier if you're ordering food into your home. Now, your background was not in this field originally. You have a corporate background, right?
Arti Mala: I do. I've bounced back and forth between traditional corporate roles and startups. And that's just been the story of my entire career. Anything but linear, I guess you could say. But it's funny, honestly, that I found myself in this space. I think like a lot of entrepreneurs that I'm sure you've spoken to, eventually folks kind of find the things that they care about, that they're passionate about, and try to build their career around that. And I think that's what led me to First Seed.
Glen Merzer: And you worked in banking?
Arti Mala: That's right. I worked in banking. So my first job out of college was at Lehman Brothers before the financial crisis. I was there a few years, left just before the financial crisis, and went to get my MBA. And then from there, bounced around between different types of jobs and tech and digital marketing and found myself back at banking for my last job before first seed. And then just realized I was was kind of done with it. I was ready to build something of my own.
Glen Merzer: Now, I know it was early in your career and we all make mistakes. But did you do anything wrong that caused Lehman Brothers to go bankrupt?
Arti Mala: Gosh, I can't say I have.
Glen Merzer: OK, so it wasn't your fault.
Arti Mala: Totally wasn't my fault. I was the most junior person at the company, as you can imagine. Just a kid out of college who thought this would be a great excuse to move to New York City.
Glen Merzer: You didn't come up with any collateralized swaps or anything that costs trillions of dollars. know, thankfully not one to blame, though was very interesting to watch, especially back When the crash actually happened, I was a business school student. It was fascinating to watch that back and just to hear kind of the anecdotes of how people even within the company experienced that. That whole.
Glen Merzer: Well, were you in the company as it was starting to get in trouble?
Arti Mala: I believe there were signs, but I wasn't aware at that point. I had just left because I was going to I wanted to change careers. I knew finance for me. So I just went back and I was in London at the time. I had moved to their London office for a year and I kind of needed an excuse to build, switch careers and move back to the States. So I applied to business school. That's what every loss soul does is they go back for their MBA, just like looking for, you know, what to do next with their life. And so I believe that there were probably signs at the time, but I think because I was so junior and so far removed from that part of the company, I didn't know look for that. It was just a happy coincidence that I wasn't working with them when everything kind of came down.
Glen Merzer: So you never heard anyone say, you know, this company is doing some shenanigans.
Arti Mala: I didn't know. I had no idea. I had no idea. At the time that I worked there, was very glamorized. was supposed to be this exceptional offer from this incredible company that I think I didn't know as much about as I probably should have.
Glen Merzer: OK, so as you've started first seed foods, have you tried to put it on a sounder financial footing than Lehman Brothers?
Arti Mala: I have. I've tried my best. There's a few decisions just on the financial front in general, an approach that I've taken that's different than most startups in that I very intentionally stayed clear from venture capital. So this is a self -financed company. And I said, like, hey, If I'm going to do this, I want to make sure that our economics make sense, that the company can survive without constantly infusing more cash into it, and that we provide a good product that folks love, they come back for, and that the numbers make sense. And two, that we wouldn't be driven by outside interests, which are sometimes when you do accept outside capital, there is a lot of pressure to grow at all costs, as I'm sure you've heard.that terminology and kind of how the tech space operates and said like, like this, we're here to provide great clean food for folks. There's a lot of different ways to do this. And oftentimes when you're pressured for numbers and growth, you take shortcuts or you do things that are otherwise unsustainable. And I just knew early on that that wasn't going to be the path for this company.
Glen Merzer: Well, I have a theory. Tell me if you think I'm wrong. It is my show, though. So you have to be gentle. If you tell me that I'm wrong. But my theory is that companies that are funded by venture capital often say as they're making strategic decisions, what decision could we make that will help us attract more venture capital? It becomes a of a feeding frenzy of how can we get more venture capital as opposed to how can we make this profitable? Am I wrong or am I right?
Arti Mala: Yeah, I think that it's unfortunately become a little bit of a bad cycle. And I think I know less about this kind of as a whole to comment on it too deeply. But what I find is that what originated as maybe a good way to finance software companies and tech companies has proliferated into every industry, including food and beverage. And these companies just aren't meant to operate quite the same way, nor provide the kind of returns and gains that investors are typically looking for and that maybe they can expect from high tech companies where your marginal costs are really low. Because as a food company or beverage company, your costs are not going to ultimately go to zero. You're still going to provide a high quality, in our case, a high quality product to your customers. And yes, you can be more efficient as you scale but it's not the same thing as tech. And that's the part that's been really tricky is that, well, as venture capital continues to fuel more more industries, like does it still make sense? Does that model still make sense? And do the returns, are the returns still there that investors are expecting and looking for? So, interesting.
Glen Merzer: Now you grew up in the United States, but you said you spent a little bit of time in India as a child?
Arti Mala: I did. lived with my grandparents a few years when I was in elementary school. And it was a phenomenal experience, one, in just getting to know my roots more, getting to know my grandparents, learning the language. So I now speak Hindi. In fact, my husband and I primarily speak Hindi at home. And it was a really incredible life experience.
Glen Merzer: And what part of India was this? New Delhi, India, so the capital.
Arti Mala: OK. And the capital. And so did you grow up when you were in India, when you're in your grandparents home, was that a vegetarian home?
Glen Merzer: It was a vegetarian home.
Arti Mala: Yes.
Glen Merzer: Were you encouraged to drink your milk?
Arti Mala: yeah, you know, it was vegetarian, but I wouldn't say it was necessarily a healthy vegetarian home. My grandparents on my father's side still had a lot of dairy in their food, still had a lot of oils and so on in their food. Everyone had a sweet tooth. vegetarian, but with kind of the big asterisks of like not necessarily the most healthy. My mom's side though, my grandparents on my mom's side actually ate very healthy. mean, very simple meals with very few ingredients and very light even on oils and such. mean, it's been interesting to watch as my grandparents who have now all since passed away, but as they got into their eighties and nineties to see how some of those decisions affected their health longer term. And you see those impacts in those later years, especially. So both vegetarian households, but still approach food very differently.
Glen Merzer: Did the healthier diet lead to longer, healthier?
Arti Mala: Absolutely. Longer, healthier, more independent. So my last grandparent, my grandfather on my mom's side passed away last year at age 98. But well into his 90s, one of the most independent people you'd ever meet. He didn't really like anyone else doing anything for him. He preferred to make his own tea in the morning. He preferred to do his own laundry to go out for a walk and get his hair cut. mean, just phenomenal to see someone in his 90s just doing so well for himself versus the other set of grandparents that unfortunately did suffer from diabetes and other health conditions as they kind of aged.
Glen Merzer: Yeah. My mother also lived to 98 and she had heart disease in her 50s.
God.
Glen Merzer: Mom, you should stop eating meat. And she did stop eating red meat and she didn't go quite vegan until she was in her late 80s and moved to California where I was. And then I did her shopping and then she went vegan. Amazing. By default. But, you know, to live from her 50s with heart disease to 98. Yeah. Was pretty good.
Absolutely. Yeah.
Glen Merzer: Now, when did you go vegan? When did you adopt this healthy lifestyle?
Yeah, you know, when I think about it, it's actually pretty recent. So all of this was both going vegan and starting this company really came out of the pandemic for me. So right at the time, just before the pandemic, I had my second kiddo. And just as I was actually getting ready to go back to work, to my corporate job as we talked about, the world shut down because I think the week I was supposed to rejoin, every company started working remotely and they said like, hey, don't come back in, we're just gonna go remote and we're gonna see where this thing goes. for the first, and daycare is closed as well, so we had enrolled our kiddos and then we had to keep them home. And as you can imagine, having a toddler and a newborn in a full -time job was chaotic recipe for disaster the first six months of the pandemic were just, we were in survival mode. Like every day was just like, can we get through the day? And a lot of that meant that we weren't cooking. So we would order fast casual salads and such some days, other things, other days. And we thought we were being relatively healthy, but you know, outside food is outside food. And so six months into the pandemic, my husband and I looked at each other and we said like, gosh, we don't feel so great. Like it's, this can't be sustainable, we can't live like this. So we went down this big rabbit hole of, how do we better take care of ourselves? How do we better take care of our kids? And by the way, these pre -existing conditions that are making COVID worse for a lot of folks is really scary. So how do we make sure we don't get those conditions? And that's what led us to plant -based eating and just thinking about nutrition in a different way. And it's one of those where you let your curiosity take over and the more you learn, the more curious you are and just kind of the cycle. It brought us back to documentaries that we hadn't seen in so many years like Forks Over Knives and all of these incredible people on the plant -based community that have been advocating for these lifestyle changes for years. And we had kind of run into, but never really taken so seriously, never adopted for ourselves. So we made a lot of those changes we started cooking our staple, which is Indian food. It's always been Indian food. And we started cooking our Indian food differently such that it didn't have any dairy, excess oils and so on. And the thing that blew us away was that the food still tasted great. And we're like, how could it be? We've been making this food our whole life. How could it be that it still tastes great without all of these additional ingredients? And so we cook that way for a full year before I then realized I was kind of done with my corporate job, looking for something else to do. And also kind of fell in love with this idea of like, gosh, what if we reintroduce Indian food in a different way, in a way that we think makes sense with what real health looks like. And yeah, so it's been a little bit of a journey both in going vegan myself and in building this company.
Glen Merzer: I've never come across an Indian restaurant that is both vegan and oil free. Is there one to your knowledge in the free world?
Not that I know of, but Glen, you'll have to let me know because the minute you tell me about it, I'm going.
Glen Merzer: Well, is there any chance that one day you'll start one?
maybe. You know, I feel like it's such a gap. It's we still to this day eat out very little because we find just very few options where we feel good about what we eat. And we'll make exceptions, of course, here and there. And there are some good chains that are offering more and more vegan options, but truly healthy, well -sour, sustainable food that you can feel good about, there are such few options out there. And gosh, if there was one that offered immune food, we would be eating there all the time. But in the meantime, while maybe that's not...available yet, also yet, because I'm hopeful that some entrepreneur somewhere is working on this, either that or maybe we'll make this a part of First Seed. We are trying to at least provide better access by shipping these foods.
Glen Merzer: Well, you certainly are providing better access and we're going to put in the show notes a discount for first time customers of First Seed Foods to get what you can't really get anywhere else that I know of healthy. delicious, oil -free, vegan Indian food. We're going to take a quick break now and we'll be back with Arti in a moment.
Glen Merzer: We're back. talking with Arti Mala, the founder of First Seed Foods, healthy Indian foods shipped around the country unless you're in Hawaii or Alaska. But that's your own choice if you're in Hawaii or Alaska. It comes with some advantages and the disadvantage that you can't get First Seed Foods. So Arti, you have two little kids. Are you trying to raise them vegan?
I am trying to, I think trying being the operative word. I do have two kids, they're younger right now and they are at this age where we can influence more of their tastes and preferences. I think as they're seven and five, almost five now, my sense is that as they grow older and have more influence from friends and someone that job becomes a little bit harder, I shared that I my husband and I went vegan, primarily vegan, after we had our second kid. So with the first one, once she was off nursing, we did introduce her to dairy milk and she was having eggs and cheese and things of that sort. And then my second one though, when he was ready to start having foods, we kept him on plant -based milk. We never introduced eggs and cheese and so on into his diet and earlier on, especially while they were in daycare, was easier for us to essentially of manage what they were eating because we always packed lunch. never did the school, you know, the daycare provided lunches. And it was a little easier now that my elder kiddo was in elementary school and even her younger brother is, you know, growing up and...observing more of the world and curious and what are my friends bringing for lunch and so on, that has become a little bit harder. So we are kind of following the 90 10 with them where everything that they enjoy at home is vegan. But when they are at school and like at a birthday party or, you know, we'll do an occasional like, yes, you're allowed to buy lunch on Friday with your friends and so on. We'll let some of that side. My husband and I talk about this all the time because there's a part of us that, you know, we want to make sure our kids are educated and understand the why between what they're eating and what's good for them and for the world and environment and so on. But we also struggle with like how much of that can feel restrictive to them as a kid and like what's the right balance there. So my hope is my wish is to raise 100 percent vegan kids if for nothing else, it's for their own health but do this in a way that they can understand and don't feel deprived and restricted. So I don't know. It's been a little bit of a parenting challenge for me,
Glen Merzer: At the ages of seven and five, and maybe it's different at the two different ages, at the ages of seven and five, do they understand the basic concept that other people eat animals and we don't?
Yeah, that's actually so that's one of the things that, you know, even when we talk about what's offered at school and like, you know, whether you opt for XYZ, if a snack is being served or something at the birthday party, they know that they don't eat animals. Like they know that that's they don't always the tricky thing for us is that we also don't want them to like say inappropriate things to their friends who are enjoying animal food.
Glen Merzer: I mean things like the inappropriate things that I say to my friends?
gosh, it's hard when your kids are in elementary school because you know, well, I will sometimes make an offhand comment and be like, my gosh, like chicken, that's so gross. what I don't, but I'm, what I'm trying to be mindful of is that kids, when they deliver that to their friends, you know, I don't want them to put their friends down necessarily. I don't want to create a confusing environment at this age about different families and how different families eat and why they do what they do. So it's been, I think some of those conversations maybe get a little bit easier when they're older. So we're kind of toying this fine line of like, well, like, how do you still be respectful about it? Because your friends are having animal foods and you're not, but in general, like, you know that we don't eat animals. Like, you know, we have so many animals that come visit our backyard. We have deer in the backyard. We have bunnies play. We have so on. And I always tell them, like, do you guys want to eat these animals? No, right? These are your friends. And so there's simple ways that I can introduce this to little ones, but it's hard when they're friends at school are having lunch that is completely normal for them. And what's the right way that you?
Glen Merzer: Yeah, I could imagine how difficult it is. I've never had children, but I could imagine wanting to say to a child, we must not be judgmental about the stupid mistake everybody else is making. And it's hard to word that, isn't it?
It's so hard. It's so hard. you know, it's something that I'm still working on. I wish I had a better answer. mean, I'm open to getting some of it.
Glen Merzer: You're doing the best you can do you and your husband. And it's just a challenging situation.
It's just a challenging situation. I mean, one way I think about it is that, like 90 % of the time, or probably more when they're at home. And again, they still you know, pack their lunch, I think occasionally we'll let them buy a school lunch, but we don't really trust the school lunches. You know, they eat homemade food, they take homemade food to school, like most of their meals are good and nutritious. And I think we'll at least have them start on a better footing than we started on as kids. And as they grow and can understand more nuance. we can kind of share a little bit more on the educational front.
Glen Merzer: How bad or good are the school lunches?
Terrible, terrible. mean, I just I think, you know, I have a lot of heartache even on the days that I say like yes to pizza Fridays. You know, I have a lot of heartache and say, OK, it's occasional like every now and then. But most school lunches are, you know, glorified junk food, unfortunately. wish I could I wish I had something positive to say about it, but I really don't. I wouldn't feel comfortable with my kids having that every day.
Glen Merzer: Now, at the age of five and seven, they were very young when COVID hit.
Yes.
Glen Merzer: So how difficult was that dealing with, I guess, toddlers in the era of a pandemic that, by the way, was caused by animal foods?
I know, I know. Gosh. I had that when COVID hit, I had a newborn and I had a toddler, you know, two and a half years old. Just absolutely wild. mean, both, think in terms of the months that we kept them home alongside work was a little chaotic. And just as it relates to food and what they were consuming, I mean, we we took a pretty sharp turn in what at least because my younger kiddo wasn't yet eating solid foods. So we had gotten more educated on plant -based foods before he was ready. But with my elder kiddo, we made a pretty dramatic shift in the foods that she was eating every day. And the good thing is though, because they've enjoyed some of these homemade foods, since they were really young, they've developed a preference for them. So we used to have a running joke that actually, even though my elder kid of now, you know, enjoys pizza for the first few years, she that's that's not one of the foods that she liked, or she even, you know, had any preference for. So even when we'd go to a birthday party, I would pack rice and beans for her. Well, all the other kids ate pizza, she would sit in and happily have her rice and beans. She just did not like pizza. She was never introduced to it. And so it's been, now there's like a little bit of a shift, you know, as they grow older, but they still eat some of the same foods that we do as their staples, because that's what's served to them at home. That's what they're a palate for. And, you know, they love sweet potato and broccoli and all of the things that, you know, I wish were offered in school lunches, but are not. Those are the missing ingredients.
Glen Merzer: Well, I think the story is that the first sentence I ever spoke when I was two years old, I said, Mommy, I would like some saga lube. So I was, you know, I just have always, always appreciate the food from the Indian culture.
I love that. my gosh. Yes. Sounds like from a very young age. You were always an advocate.
Glen Merzer: So do your kids love Indian food?
They do. They do. eat. I mean, that's just our stable at home. we eat a lot. were good kids.
Glen Merzer: They're good kids.
On the whole, they're good kids.
Glen Merzer: That's good. And what tell me about the herbs and spices you use? Can consumers choose how spicy they want the food? And if so, what herbs and spices do you use?
Yeah, there's a few staples that I think go into most of the dishes from a spice level perspective. It's such a good question. It's one that I get probably most frequently is how spicy is the food? I customize it? And I get requests on both sides, folks that want it much spicier and folks that are like, look, like any spec of red chili powder or even black pepper. And it's not for me. So unfortunately, because you know, the foods are produced, they're in small batches, but in enough of a bulk that we're not really able to customize by container. And then of course there's additional overhead then of managing that many different varieties of a food that we just offer the one spice level for every food. We try to keep that pretty mild. I surveyed customers and I asked them like, how would you describe the spice level back to me? And most folks selected either a mild or a medium. So, you know, it's meant to be accessible enough that look, if you're sensitive to spice and if you're pairing that with like a brown rice or some steamed vegetables, it should still be very accessible to you. A lot of parents feed these foods to their young children and who young children tend to be also very sensitive to spice levels. And, you know, we found good luck in it being pretty accessible. But you'll always, always find folks who still it's too spicy for them or still it's not spicy enough. It doesn't have that kick that they're looking for that they typically find in, let's say a restaurant, you know, like a high spice level. So We just have the one that's unfortunately not customizable. But the thought is that, look, you can add chili powder to it. You can add hot sauce and kind of make it.
Glen Merzer: If you're ordering in a restaurant and you like spicy food and it doesn't come spicy enough for you, it's a little awkward to say, could you take this back and add more spices? Most people wouldn't say that. But if you're ordering from first seed foods and you want it a little spicier, you're going to be warming it up anyway.
Yeah.
Glen Merzer: So you could always add more spice, right?
Absolutely. And I see that's the same for our salt -free or SOS -free versions. So we have six foods and each of those foods is available in an SOS -free version. And for folks who are not 100 % SOS -free but still want to watch for how much salt, that's the best option is that you get the SOS -free version and you can sprinkle a little bit on top, which I a lot of doctors advocate for anyway, in that it's a little bit better to add on top versus cooked in your food. So, you know, there's ways to make it your own. I like to think and you know, the spices are really, I think what has made this whole thing possible, right? So like, how can you possibly remove the dairy and the oils and still have this great delicious tasting food? It's a credit to the spices and we found ways and I've shared very publicly because I want folks to be able to enjoy Indian food at home should they choose that. you can make these foods with the right spices and just cooking them differently. So you're cooking them in water instead of oil, you're dry roasting them in the oven or on the stove, and you're still getting to enjoy the aromas, the flavors, the complexity that some of these foods offer. But without all the junk of it, some of the staples that we use for folks that are looking to cook Indian food and want to experiment at home, And, you know, just for aromas and kind of that base flavor, cloves are great. Bay leaves, cinnamon sticks, those are staples you'll find as an ingredient in a majority of our foods. And we use whole spices wherever possible as well. So we're not using, you know, like a powder. We're using like the actual cinnamon sticks and we're using the actual bay leaves. right.
Glen Merzer: Now I have to ask you about bay leaves.
yeah.
Glen Merzer: Because I have never understood bay leaves. I understand ginger and garlic. You put the ginger and the garlic in the food and you get the taste of the ginger and the garlic. It makes sense to me. I've always believed that bay leaves are some kind of a strange myth. There's this special leaf and you cook it with the food, but then you have to take it out and then people imagine that they can taste it. Is that True, people actually, I mean, have they ever done a taste test where they took 10 meals, was a bay leaf in these 10 and there wasn't in these 10, and then people can tell? Is it a real thing or is it just some kind of a crazy myth?
I think that it's so subtle that it's, I wonder now, that's a great question. I wonder if a taste test would really
Glen Merzer: I think it's a mass delusion. But the aromas can you tell me edible things that somebody went into the bay leaf business and said, let's just tell people that they can taste it and we'll make a lot of money selling bay leaves. And it could have been, you know, like sycamore tree leaves.
I have this debate with a close friend of mine all the time. Yes. We're like, what is the bay leaf doing?
Glen Merzer: Yeah, it's the whole thing's a crazy myth. That's hilarious. But I went into the bay leaf business. He was a genius. But I say there's nothing there.
my gosh. Well, I have found a difference in the aromas. All right. I will say that if nothing else, it's adding some value into the overall sensory experience.
Glen Merzer: I think what it's good for is the ingredient list. People say, there's a bay leaf.
I think you might be onto something. We're gonna have to see if we'll have to correct all of our recipes to take those pesky bay leaves. Because we don't actually remove them. We don't actually leave them in so they're not ground in or anything. We steep them in because I believe they add something. But those are some great bay spices. And then some of the others that are just so classic that you'll find in every, or many Indian foods is your coriander powders and your cumin powders. Turmeric, of course, which I know is all the rage.
Glen Merzer: these are some of the healthiest spices in the world with just so much antioxidant power.
my gosh. Yeah. Most nutrient dense foods in the world are some of these Indian spices, especially the there's a lot of research to suggest that when you pair turmeric with black pepper, it actually unlocks more of turmeric's anti -inflammatory properties. So we actually made made sure to kind of have that in that combination in a lot of our spice mixes. And then there's, you the fun ones, like a mango powder is great for that little bit of kick. So we have that in our Chana Masala, which I think folks really appreciate and actually even in the yellow lentils. So yeah, I mean, we had a lot of fun playing with different spices and herbs because they just add so much value to the food. And again, they don't have to be paired with oil the way they typically are in a traditional Tarka, as we call it, is that's when you temper the spices before adding the foods. But it's absolutely possible to do without.
Glen Merzer: Right. And it's possible that bay leaves are healthy, but no one will know because you have to take them out.
Yeah, that's true. I'm determined to research this kind of bay leaf situation after this.
Glen Merzer: Yeah, I'm going to become the enemy of the bay leaf industry. I hope I don't get threats.
my gosh.
Glen Merzer: Now you confided to me, Arti, that you were getting over COVID. And I can tell you there hasn't been a single cough. You look very healthy. I think it's because of your healthy vegan diet.
gosh. It certainly was one of the things that inspired us to go vegan is that we wanted to try to mute some of the impact of getting some of these viruses and diseases that are quite scary. I think, unfortunately, in the world that we live in is going to become more more common. But yeah, one I have noticed this time around, I actually haven't gotten sick in more than a year. So it caught me off guard. and I was surprised thinking about it when I got sick. was like, gosh, I really I haven't gotten I haven't fallen sick in over a year. How wonderful is that?
Glen Merzer: you gotten COVID more than once?
I have gotten COVID once before, but I believe that was about a year, maybe more than a year ago.
Glen Merzer: And was it mild?
It was. haven't... Well, maybe when COVID first hit, so maybe I have gotten it more than once. Actually, I think I was more impacted by the vaccines than I was COVID. The vaccines really knocked me out.
Glen Merzer: Did your husband get COVID?
He has. I think when you have kids and..school.
Glen Merzer: And was it mild?
Compared to everything that everyone's been to, yes. Yes. I think in general that's the thing. T
Glen Merzer: This is the story that isn't told enough. Dr. Kim Williams, who's the past president of the American College of Cardiology, has spoken about this on podcasts. I heard him say it on Rip Esselstyn's podcast. I heard him say it on Chef AJ's podcast. He's been asking around. Does anyone know anyone on a healthy diet who died of COVID? It was a serious pandemic that attacked people on unhealthy diets. It attacked people with type two diabetes, people who were obese, people with heart disease. Yes, some old frail people and so forth. the most part, people who are on a healthy, low -fat, vegan diet, it's like getting a cold. Yeah. mild flu. As far as Dr. Kim Williams knows, and as far as I know, there was not a single death in people who eat the way we eat.
Yeah.
Glen Merzer: It just, we didn't get severe COVID. So they put all that money into the mRNA vaccine, or they could have said to people, just order first seed foods. Of course, you weren't yet around with first seed foods. Wouldn't that be wonderful? point. They could have said, just eat healthy. Yeah. And they could have saved hundreds of thousands of lives.
Gosh. know. It's, you know, even in my own extended family, You know, I two sisters who are primarily vegan, not a hundred percent, but primarily, and more and more folks that are more conscious of their, what they eat more than ever. But even in that extended family, I'd say that, like the message is still lost somewhere. And I think that it's in some part being ready to hear it. So, you know, again, we went down this journey of like trying to find the right answer for like, do we better take care of ourselves? But for a lot of folks, it's when what they hear is so different from what they've heard all their life and, you know, been practiced by the people around them, especially the people that they trust the most, it's really hard. It's a hard thing to kind of battle and kind of get through to, I think sometimes the folks that probably need to hear it the most. So I don't know. mean, I'm hopeful that books such as the one that you're putting out are going to make some of this more exciting and more accessible for folks. But we have a long way to go, really long way to go.
Glen Merzer: Well, Arti, it's been a pleasure speaking with you and continued success with First Seed Foods. We're going to put a discount in the show notes and
be ordering again soon.
Amazing. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you having me on. And this was such a fun conversation. Thank you, Glen.
Glen Merzer: Thank you, Arti. Take care. Take care.
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